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Music Piracy Documentary Released As Torrent

Posted by kdawson on Thu Aug 02, 2007 09:24 AM
from the eating-the-dogfood dept.
goodbye_kitty writes "The producers of a new documentary film analyzing global music piracy have decided to 'put their money where their mouth is' by releasing the film as a free Xvid download (hosted by the Pirate Bay, as one would expect). The film explores the blurred line between 'fair use' and piracy, and includes interviews with DJ Danger Mouse (creator of the now infamous 'grey album'), Lawrence Lessig (founder of Creative Commons), the lads from the Pirate Bay, and even some guy from the MPAA. Here is a link to the torrent."
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  • by InvisblePinkUnicorn (1126837) on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:26AM (#20085731)
    Are you sure it wasn't simply the case that they're out of money and/or nobody will distribute the documentary for them?
    • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:36AM (#20085865)

      Are you sure it wasn't simply the case that they're out of money and/or nobody will distribute the documentary for them?

      Or maybe they're just clever and realise they can get lots of free publicity on sites like /. by releasing the programme as a torrent. Don't think we'll ever know, but you're reading this article aren't you?

      Unfortunately am in Canada and Bittorrent has been banned [torrentfreak.com] by the Internet Police [rogers.com] over here, so we're not allowed to download files.

      • by halcyon1234 (834388) <halcyon1234@hotmail.com> on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:43AM (#20085969) Journal
        You can download just fine on Rogers. I sure do. Just be sure to use the "Encrypt Traffic" option on Azureus, and set yourself up with a non-standard port. Check out the Azureus Wiki on NAT Problems [azureuswiki.com] on how to do this. I suggest using a port like 25522 or something like that.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by ajs (35943)

        Unfortunately am in Canada and Bittorrent has been banned [torrentfreak.com] by the Internet Police [rogers.com] over here, so we're not allowed to download files.

        Wow. That's totally freaking insane!

        Next time I download an OS via BT, I'll think of you... I'm really sorry, man.

        That said, I'm a little surprised and disappointed at Slashdot's reaction to this documentary. Someone does a documentary about file sharing, puts it up on BT and we attack them for it... sad. I would have thought we'd be glad to see that someone is finally starting to smell the new media. Do they want their documentary seen? Of course, they do, but if this works out, you know there will be tho

        • Next time I download an OS via BT, I'll think of you... I'm really sorry, man.
          Don't feel that sorry. It's not true. I'm on Rogers and I use Azureus with encryption. I get 300KB/s torrent downloads just fine. They recently bumped up speeds for free from 4Mb to 6Mb so I'm sure the potential Bittorrent speeds are much faster than I get. I'm just at the mercy of whoever's uploading.
            • There's probably something with the cables on your street or in your house/apartment. I had the same problem when I lived with my parents. Just ask them to come check out the lines. They should be able to fix it for free and give you a refund on as many months as you complain about.
                • Just a heads up - one time our cable connection got "noisy" as well. This ended up being due to some road construction work that was done right near our house. Rogers had to dig a huge deep hole in our front yard to fix it. It only took about 3 days, they didn't charge us anything, and they replaced the grass. Still it was a real nuisance and eyesore.
        • Someone does a documentary about file sharing, puts it up on BT and we attack them for it... sad. I would have thought we'd be glad to see that someone is finally starting to smell the new media.

          They put it on BT because their target auditory uses BT, not because they are "smelling new media".

      • by gsslay (807818)
        Alleged throttling and shaping != banning
      • Oddly enough when I clicked on the link for the torrent download, my torrent application generated the following message box: "Torrent Task Exist!"

        ---------
        Created time: 2007.07.11 11:19:34
        Finish time: 2007.07.11 14:29:53
        ---------

        Apparently I downloaded this last month and it was so great that I forgot to even watch it.
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Jeff DeMaagd (2015)
      I really wonder about that. A lot of movies don't get a distributorship, it's a basic fact of the industry, even more so with indie films.

      Anyways, "blurring the line between fair use and piracy" is a red flag to me. I really won't agree with an argument that somehow fair use can be blurred to the extend that distributing entire works (entire songs, entire albums, entire movies, entire TV episodes) to potentially millions of people is somehow fair use. Fair use has usually been interpreted as short clippi
      • by kebes (861706) on Thursday August 02 2007, @10:10AM (#20086367) Journal
        Well of course the "blurred line" won't appear when you counterpoint two extremes: short clips on the one hand (clearly fair use) versus distributing full copies to millions of people on the other hand (clearly copyright infringement, according to current laws).

        However, your implication that there is no "blurred line" isn't fair. The example given in the summary is DJ Danger Mouse, who mixed two different works to create something totally original. The music labels said that this was "clearly infringement" whereas many artists and fans said this work was novel and original, and clearly something that should be allowed under fair use (whether or not it actually is fair use is for courts to decide, I suppose, but the arguments regarding copyright are not so much about what the law is, but rather what it should be). This is one case where there is disagreement about how to interpret the actions, hence a "blurred line."

        Lawrence Lessig (in his books, blog entries, talks, etc.) provides many other examples of activities which straddle this line (e.g. a film-maker begin told to pay thousands of dollars because a Simpsons clip was playing in the background of one of the scenes in a documentary). Sometimes they are legal yet still legally persecuted by the big-labels. Sometimes they are illegal yet many people feel they are legitimate personal uses, or important creative uses. These fringe cases are very interesting.

        Now, I have not watched the documentary under discussion, so I can't say whether they tackle these fringe cases in a thoughtful way. However, I can honestly say that there is a dangerous blurred line between what you are allowed to do according to "fair use" and what you are going to get in trouble for doing according to "copyright law." The fact that this line is so ill-defined is what leads to all the questionable lawsuits against artists and end-users... and to a chilling effect in the production of creative works (which Lessig worries about constantly).
      • IANAL, but it doesn't seem to me that the concept of fair use was well-defined in the first place (and therefore has never been anything but blurry). Certainly there have been decisions by courts that some particular use is fair, but it does not necessarily follow that all other uses are unfair and punishable. My understanding is that even a conservative legal attempt to define "fair use" would be a bit like trying to define "self defense". It's not a cut-and-dry issue, but rather one that has to be inte

        • My understanding is that even a conservative legal attempt to define "fair use" would be a bit like trying to define "self defense". It's not a cut-and-dry issue, but rather one that has to be interpreted a bit on a case-by-case basis.

          yes, it needs to be determined on a case-by-case basis, by the courts... not by corporations, not by lobbyists, not by useless technologies, not by ISPs, not by site operators, not by high priced legal goon squads and not by trade groups.

          the problem is that you can use the

    • Not many people pay to see propaganda documentaries to begin with, and file sharing is such an exciting topic...War in Iraq, National Health-care Crisis, File Sharing...
  • Pay time (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ciryon (218518) on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:28AM (#20085755) Journal
    I wonder who's paying the producers salaries.
    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      It's at least partially funded by Denmark's national broadcasting corporation. It was produced and aired here more than three months ago, so part of the salaries are paid by the Danish television license fee payers (not including myself).

      They ask [goodcopybadcopy.net] for donations though.

    • Their parents? At least, until they graduate...
  • Why? (Score:4, Funny)

    by Todd Fisher (680265) on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:31AM (#20085787) Homepage
    Why would I get this off the web for free when I can pay for it at a store?
  • Oldddd (Score:5, Informative)

    by zeridon (846747) on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:38AM (#20085895) Homepage
    That's way too old.
    It has been circulating around for about a year or so ...
    It appeared shortly after the movie Steal This Film [stealthisfilm.com]
  • by samuel4242 (630369) on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:41AM (#20085933)
    I wish I could be optimistic for their bank account, but here's what will probably happen: the file sharing crowd will download it, watch it with a few beers, nod in constant agreement, curse the Man, and then raise a beer in a toast to the coolness of the producers. Perhaps a few will even contribute to the tip jar. But the jar won't fill up enough to pay for the time put into the project. And the producers sure won't make enough money to support themselves or a family so they can do such a cool thing again. Oh well.
    • by Yonatanz (798506) on Thursday August 02 2007, @09:50AM (#20086049) Homepage
      Also, the producers' work will be viewed by thousands of people, and probably reviewed by tens of professionals and might reach production company managers, who may hire them for their next movie...

      If you are unknown, then this can be the perfect entrance to the industry. But you have to be good so that your free product is at least somewhat impressive.
      • It's always refreshing to find someone posting one's exact thoughts and sentiments.

        This is certainly an opportunity for the creators, here. This world of today is so concerned with cash that we seem to forget the value of things which do not produce cash.

        Really, those like the FSF, Creative Commons and the EFF should in fact be sponsoring these kind of productions. That would then be genuine revenue for the creators.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by shark72 (702619)

        "Also, the producers' work will be viewed by thousands of people, and probably reviewed by tens of professionals and might reach production company managers, who may hire them for their next movie..."

        Ah yes, the "design my website for free" argument.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by samuel4242 (630369)
        Also, the producers' work will be viewed by thousands of people, and probably reviewed by tens of professionals and might reach production company managers, who may hire them for their next movie...

        I hate to be negative, but I can't see some producer saying, "Gosh, these radical dudes really did a great job undermining the reason why I'm able to get million dollar paychecks. I think I'll hire them to do my next movie. And I'll pay them millions even though they have argued that file sharers shouldn't ha
      • Also, the producers' work will be viewed by thousands of people, and probably reviewed by tens of professionals and might reach production company managers, who may hire them for their next movie...

        My guess is that the folks in Hollywood are much more likely to see crowdsourcing and Creative Commons as a way to get cheap material. They'll pat this guy on the head, give him $1000 to set up some stick-it-to-the-man website, and then collect the results into a movie that's then released to theaters. The t
    • Why does their bank account have to be the bottom line?
      Why couldn't they maybe, just maybe, want this to be free, be willing to put this documentary out there so that anyone can see it for free, even at a (monetary) loss to them? What is wrong with contributing to the public good without focusing on what you are going to get in return?

      Capitalists. Yech.
    • ... the file sharing crowd will download it, watch it with a few beers, nod in constant agreement, curse the Man, and then raise a beer in a toast to the coolness of the producers. Perhaps a few will even contribute to the tip jar. But the jar won't fill up ...

      That's precisely the story of the teams who made the Half Life mods CounterStrike and Portal. They were noticed by Valve Software and hired. Even if they weren't they'd have a heck of a portfolio for their next job interview.

      • Again, I hate to be negative. But why would I cancel Shark Week or whatever else is on so I can show some documentary that's already reached it's entire target audience via BitTorrent?

        Consider this script:
        Lackey: One of our viewers is on the phone, sir. Do you want to take the call?
        Moneyman: Why?
        Lackey: They downloaded a film and loved it enough.
        Moneyman: Great. What do they want from me?
        Lackey: They want you to pay the guy and broadcast the film.
        Moneyman: Why? So they can see it again?
        Lack
  • infamous == bad (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    the word infamous means famous in a disgraceful way. it's a bad thing. you're not using it right.
    • whoa there.. (Score:2, Insightful)

      by newr00tic (471568)

      the word infamous means famous in a disgraceful way. it's a bad thing. you're not using it right.

      That depends on whether you consider fame to be a good thing or not.

      (Infamity ftw)

      • Dangermouse's Grey album, like all mashups that haven't had their rights negotiated with the original artists' legal representatives are illegal.

        Well, thank you for your ruling your honor.

        Once upon a time, breaking the law was thought of as vaguely 'bad' and 'disgraceful', so the term sounds fine to me.

        And then we were flooded with stupid laws, laws that most people don't want, and laws that were just downright immoral to enforce.

        Saying that breaking a law (like the "blacks in back" from the 60s) is always
  • good copy bad copy is a very well produced movie.
    it also has interviews from some of the key players in this copyright fight.

    now i want to find some techno brega music!
  • by Floritard (1058660) on Thursday August 02 2007, @11:46AM (#20088109)

    Here is a link to the torrent.
    Fuck that. Where my NZB file yo?
  • Here [google.com] is the google video link.
  • I went and download the film using Bit Torrent. I felt very cutting edge doing this! I could feel my hipness level rising.

    I watched the first third of the film, then skipped around in the rest of the film. The first section of the film discussed an important copyright infringement case surrounding the use of samples. However, in spite of the clever editing employed, the movie didn't illuminate the issue very well. I was left wanting to understand more about the sample itself (which I couldn't hear well at a
    • by jZnat (793348) *
      It's more likely to be uploaded to Google Video since they have a much larger file size limit.
    • it DOES have a negative financial impact on the producers of that content.

      How do you know?

      You have to factor in the fact that seeing a movie/listening to a song is advertisement for that work and for the creators of that work. I don't know if this is going to be enough to counter the loss from the people who download the work instead of buying it (not all "pirates" are in this category, but I digress), but it does need to be considered.

      If you have evidence (a study, statistics) that there is a negative impact, I would be very interested to see it. (Any study done by the MPAA

        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by lilomar (1072448)

          I doubt it's very feasible to do a real, independent study on this.

          I tend to agree with you on this.
          But it doesn't [washingtonpost.com] stop [com.com] people [harvard.edu] from [princeton.edu] trying [unc.edu].
          (The last two are PDFs)

          I never said that it outweighed, or even matched the lost revenue, I said it might which means you can't say for sure that piracy has a negative impact.
          I tend to believe that piracy doesn't have a negative impact though because of an interesting observation that I read somewhere. (but I can't for the life of me remember where, could have been a /. post)

          There are 3 types of pirates:

          1. People who would have b
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Kingrames (858416)
      That's not true and it's never been true.

      If i want to buy and view the movie "300" but a friend comes over with a movie of his and we watch that instead, I am no less inclined to eventually purchase and watch the movie 300. If he made me spend money to watch his movie, then I would be less inclined.

      Even if the movie in question WAS 300, I'd still be willing to go and purchase it if I decided it was worth my money, and a lot of movies are.

      The argument you're implying is that getting something for free makes
      • The reason these guys hunt down and victimize kids and college students is because they can write off their legal expenses as a cost of doing business and hopefully slip into a lower tax bracket, cheating the American people out of tax money.

        That makes no sense. They have to have some reason other than saving a little tax money, because they have to spend more than what they'll save. The tax savings may partially offset the legal expenses, reducing somewhat the risk of litigation, but they don't even eliminate all of the litigation expenses much less produce a net gain.

        • They also get a lot of perks from Congress by pointing their fingers and saying "see? our profits are down, so you're losing money too."
        • And I doubt they'd have ever even gotten into movies if they didn't think they could get them for free.

          Regardless, you can't prove otherwise.