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Record-Breaking Model Rocket Launch Set For April 25
Posted by
timothy
on Sat Apr 18, 2009 01:27 PM
from the mx-missile-would-have-been-more-exciting dept.
from the mx-missile-would-have-been-more-exciting dept.
darkjohnson writes with this impressive excerpt from Rocketry Planet: "On April 25, 2009, history will be made. At Higgs Farm in Price, Maryland, Steve Eves will enter the history books as the person who flew the largest model rocket in history. The rocket will weigh over 1,600 pounds, it will stand over 36 feet tall and it will be powered by a massive array of nine motors: eight 13,000ns N-Class motors and a 77,000ns P-Class motor."
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Takes me back (Score:5, Funny)
Even though it makes this stuff [amazon.com] look pretty simple in comparison, it still makes me want to dig out my old home made launcher and build a rocket.
I remember as a teenager saving up for months to buy the Estes designer's kit. I set up a card table in my room where I designed and built quite a few rockets - nothing that used bigger than a D engine. I'll never forget the night I left a bottle of dope open on the table. Very bizarre dreams that night. Learned to keep the window open when I worked on stuff and to shut everything up when I was done.
Top Gear (Score:3, Interesting)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_b4WzWFKQ20 [youtube.com]
where they launch a Reliant Robin (old 3 wheel car) as a re-usable space shuttle on the back of one of these things
I wonder how the size compares?
So..... (Score:5, Interesting)
When exactly does a model rocket become just a rocket?
Re:So..... (Score:5, Insightful)
When the FAA and NASA know about it...
Parent
Re:So..... (Score:5, Interesting)
The FAA probably already knows about this rocket. I've been to a few launches with a local rocketry club, and they always get FAA clearance. My understanding is that they have a permanent clearance for their launch site for the first few thousand feet, but when they're launching the high-power rockets, they get unlimited clearance, making the area essentially a no-fly zone for planes. (Although that clearly didn't stop the Predator drone that was hanging out above us one day.)
Parent
Re:So..... (Score:5, Interesting)
I was talking with a friend about 5-10 years back and the FAA had recently pulled all approvals for model rocket launches. Being the resourceful group that model rocketeers are, they found some connections and got all set to launch from some Navy proving grounds. FAA got wind of that and got all huffy and said "no no no boys."
And then the Navy got all huffy at the FAA, "You talking to me?"
Must have been a fun few meetings!
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Well, in theory the civilian FAA should have more authority over domestic airspace in peacetime. And until a formal declaration of war is in effect, we are at "peace". The FAA decides what airspace is restricted, not the military.
Re:So..... (Score:4, Informative)
Parent
Navy Vs FAA Cagematch (Score:4, Funny)
Well, that breaks down when the FAA tries to take over control of one of the Navy's designated area of operations.
Right, because the Navy has weapons and the FAA doesn't. I'll put my money on the Navy in that fight.
Parent
Re:Navy Vs FAA Cagematch (Score:4, Insightful)
And so does the guy at the FAA. While the FAA has jurisdiction over the granting of the airspace, I don't see that they will win in a dispute especially if the Navy is still using those proving grounds. The guy at the FAA who insists that they modelers not launch has one option to force the Navy not to let them launch: revoke the Navy's privileges. Now that's going to be a bureaucratic mess with all sorts of paperwork and battles. When their bosses step in and see what the dispute here's what they are going to hear.
Navy guy: The FAA is revoking our license to the proving grounds.
Navy boss: On what grounds?
FAA guy: The Navy is allowing prohibited actions on the grounds. We have the right to revoke. I have initiated the proper paperwork to revoke.
FAA boss: What prohibited actions are being allowed?
FAA guy: They are launching model rockets there.
FAA boss: So let me get this straight. You have initiated a move that involves at least 6 months of meetings and paperwork. And gotten us into a turf war with the Navy because you don't like them launching model rockets from their site. Gentleman, I thank the Navy for its time. This matter will be resolved here very shortly.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
No sir. The FAA sets those areas at the request of the military. If it came down to a real legal turf war, the FAA must have the ultimate authority. Otherwise we are under military rule. As far as I know the US is not...yet.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
When it's more then a glorified pop-bottle rocket.
Which means it has to have active stabilization and a guidance package.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Sometime just before the government steps in and shuts down the whole project.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
When an antagonistic foreign power launches it. I get the feeling this guy is about to be declared an antagonistic foreign power.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
it's a model rocket because it's a 1/10th scale replica of the saturn V.
I think this dude has crossed a line (Score:4, Insightful)
What I'm trying to say is this dude's rocket ain't no model - he's launching a real rocket.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Is he German and does the rocket's flight path point towards London?
broken summary (Score:3, Informative)
"On April 25, 2009, history will be made. At Higgs Farm in Price, Maryland, Steve Eves will enter the history books as the person who flew the largest model rocket in history. The rocket will weigh over 1,600 pounds, it will stand over 36 feet tall and it will be powered by a massive array of nine motors: eight 13,000ns N-Class motors and a 77,000ns P-Class motor."
Re:broken summary (Score:5, Informative)
eight 13,000ns N-Class motors and a 77,000ns P-Class motor
So that's a 90-microsecond array?
(They mean Ns - yes, case matters with physical units...)
Parent
Surprised they let him (Score:5, Insightful)
Not joking here, i'm surprised the government has not stepped in and stopped him.
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
"when rockets are outlawed, only outlaws will have rockets"
weak, i know. it's a boring rainy day...
Re:Surprised they let him (Score:5, Informative)
The BATF tried to stop all amateur rocketry beyond the toy size but they lost the lawsuit. A Federal judge ruled that solid rocket fuel of the type used by these rockets is not an explosive.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
> Why did they?
Because it is in their nature to grab for power and "terrorism" provided an excuse.
Re:Surprised they let him (Score:5, Insightful)
In order to justify it's existance and grow, a government bureau must continuously find new excuses to add layers of regulatory bureaucracy and new things to regulate. They were far far more interested in throwing their weight around and making people kiss their ass than they were in any sort of safety or public well-being.
The fact that the rocket engine cores cannot be made to explode even intentionally was irrelevant to them. A regulatory agency saw a group of people who they weren't directly regulating. The group was small enough to not create an inconveniently noisy public protest but large enough to stroke their collective ego.
Parent
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Well, with a maximum altitude under 5000 feet, this guy's not going for performance, he's just putting a scale model up in the air high enough to say it flew. High performance means high propellant mass fractions (where up to 90% of the launch weight is propellant) and almost certainly multiple stages. This rocket has an 18% propellant fraction and is single stage. It will look very cool coming off the launchpad and that's all it needs to do.
The government gets interested when you start heading for 50,00
The Astronaut Farmer... (Score:2)
Reminds me of this not amazing, but fun for kids movie about a guy that built the full size thing in his backyard.
Funny, the alarmist guy here sounds like some of the government types int he movie :)
http://entertainment.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1203785&cid=27628631 [slashdot.org]
Kind of like being... (Score:4, Funny)
.....the world's tallest midget?
This is amazing (Score:4, Funny)
Uh-oh! (Score:2, Funny)
it will stand over 36 fe*END OF CARRIER*
Little did Timothy know the true purpose of the rocket and its payload. ::evil laughter in the distance::
communications (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:communications (Score:5, Funny)
It would be ironic, if this thing performed better than North Korea's "communications" rocket. Of course, then North Korean agents would start scrounging the US for model rocket engines, for their next attempt:
"Hello, Estes http://www.estesrockets.com/rocketengines.php [estesrockets.com]? We would like to buy a lot of engines. Yes, it will be a VERY big model rocket."
Parent
In other news... (Score:4, Funny)
"On April 25, 2009, history will be made. At Higgs Farm in Price, Maryland, Steve Eves will enter the history books as the person who flew the smallest full-scale rocket in history. The rocket will weigh over 1,600 pounds, it will stand over 36 feet..."
The first model rocket with enough energy... (Score:2, Funny)
...need to prove the existence of the Higgs Farm. Some have theorized that all vegetables gain their mass from the Higgs field. Now we may finally know.
Model Rocket (Score:2, Interesting)
I thought model rockets were just when you were following a kit and/or exact instructions..... I would think this would just fall under amateur rocketry....
From wikipedia:
A model rocket is a small rocket capable of being launched by anybody, to generally low altitudes (usually to around 100-500 m (300-1500 ft) for a 30 g (1 oz.) model) and recovered by a variety of means.
According to the National Association of Rocketry, (NAR) Safety Code[1], model rockets are constructed of paper, wood, plastic and other l
Site Slashdotted (Score:2)
How does one add tags, or is that for ubergurus only? This site has crashed and burned. I got database errors, the first page for a moment, and then:
This site is temporarily unavailable.
Please notify the System Administrator
Re: (Score:2)
This site has crashed and burned.
A bad Omen before a launch.
A "model" rocket? (Score:3, Interesting)
I have a hard time seeing how something larger and more powerful than most of Goddard's devices can be called a "model". Amateur-built, sure. But not a "model".
sPh
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
The only thing I would say that goes against your point is that this is a 1/10th scale model of a Saturn V. That's enough in my mind to call it a model.
Re:A "model" rocket? (Score:4, Informative)
I have a hard time seeing how something larger and more powerful than most of Goddard's devices can be called a "model". Amateur-built, sure. But not a "model".
sPh
Did you bother to click to the article? It's a model of a Saturn V. A real Saturn V is ten times taller. So, yes, it's a 1:10 scale model of a frelling HUGE rocket, and is therefore quite large on an absolute scale, but it is still a model.
Parent
High Powered Model Rocketry (Score:4, Interesting)
William D Howell Sr.
Don't count your chickens (Score:3, Funny)
I was waiting for an editorial comment to the effect of "knock on wood."
He could very easily become the person who exploded the largest model rocket before it left the launch pad.
Google for "MudRock" (Score:3, Interesting)
Every year they launch from BLM land on the Blackrock dessert. On two days the have FAA clearance to 100,000' MSL
Last year the highest rocket hit 31,000' MSL and hit just pver mach 3. The motor had a burn time of just a little under 4 seconds.
And yes the FAA issues NOTAM's ( Notice to airman ) with the appropriate lat and long for the launch area.
Hire him (Score:3, Funny)
Considering their most recent attempt was a grand botch-o-lito
FAA Rocketry Rules (Score:5, Informative)
The US Federal Aviation Administration rules relevant to unmanned rocketry are in CFR Title 14, 101.21 to 101.27 [gpoaccess.gov]. In 101.22 one finds the definitions of "Model Rocket", "High-Power Rocket", and "Advanced High-Power Rocket" relevant in the United States:
So according to this taxonomy, Mr. Eves' rocket is an advanced high-power rocket, and is not a model rocket.
Oh, yeh. (Score:3, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
At 1600 pounds and 36 feet when does a model rocket become just a rocket?
When it achieves orbit around Uranus?
Picture of the model, since the site is slow http://www.rocketryplanet.com/images/content/2829/1.jpg [rocketryplanet.com]
Re: (Score:2)
The only reason I can think of that this is being called a model rocket, is that it is using engines of the same basic design as modern model rockets. If this was being launched by more traditional rocket fuels then due it the size and weight it would surely be a full fledged rocket.
More traditional fuels? (Score:3, Informative)
The propellant formulations (Ammonium Perchlorate Composite Propellant--APCP) used for high power model rockets are essentially the same as the one used in the solid rocket boosters that lift the Space Shuttle.
Granted, model rockets don't use LOX. LH2 or hypergolics, but some of us are playing around with hybrids like Rutan used on SpaceShipOne.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
The sanctioning organization for model rocketry is called Tripoli, so named because its founder sold a collection of Libyan coins to get the incorporation money. That caused a bit of a flap during the troubles with Khaddafi, but they managed to straighten it out.
rj