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It's funny.  Laugh. Sci-Fi Books Media

SF Writers Sting Supposedly Traditional Publisher 474

deeptrace writes "A group of SF writers all submitted purposely awful stories to a publisher that purported to publish only selected high quality works. They created the worst story they could come up with, and it was accepted for publication." Their press release is pretty funny -- and if you'd like a sample of their insane prose, it's available through the book's Lulu site. (Where, Yes, you could also buy the whole thing.)
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SF Writers Sting Supposedly Traditional Publisher

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  • No surprise here. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by SpaceCadetTrav ( 641261 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @02:07AM (#11588091) Homepage
    How do you think stories get published on Slashdot?
  • Weird acronym use (Score:2, Insightful)

    by papaskunk ( 718169 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @02:13AM (#11588104)
    I understand that SF can be meant to stand for "Science Fiction," though I don't think I've ever heard anybody say "I like to read a lot of SF." However, when we have virtually unlimited screen real estate, is it really necessary to shorten 'SciFi' to 'SF'? It's just a difference of three letters. Living in the Bay Area, I immediately thought this was an electic group of liberal-minded San Francisco writers publishing something scandalous under a "traditional" publisher. Guess the joke's on me.
  • by infonography ( 566403 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @02:26AM (#11588144) Homepage
    Good or bad doesn't matter. If you sync with their expectations you get published. Karma whores here have realised that. The Slashdot process is impartial to a degree and otherwise blind. The decline has encouraged Group Think and UNPOPULAR opinion is caught by the mechinism.

    Like here at slashdot there isn't a variety of styles mingling. One theory has won the darwinian battle and thus realising it they have gamed that system.

    Entropy is a law after all.

  • Re:old news (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Mr. Slippery ( 47854 ) <.tms. .at. .infamous.net.> on Sunday February 06, 2005 @02:51AM (#11588227) Homepage
    This news is at least 2 or 3 days old, what's wrong with /. lately???

    The same thing that's been wrong for years: people who don't understand that something that happened a few days ago - even a few weeks ago - is still news.

    Great, you heard about it days ago, doubtless you monitor all sorts of websites and cable news channels 24/7 and know everything before the rest of us. Congratulations, you win. But those of us who occasionally turn away from the various glass teats appreciate hearing about things that may have happened more than five minutes ago.

  • by CosmeticLobotamy ( 155360 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @03:37AM (#11588371)
    Your "guy who usually doesn't know what he's talking about but doesn't know enough to know he doesn't know what he's talking about complains about 'opinion' suppression" (Whine) style post has been accepted.

    Today's statistics:

    Karma-whore: 377
    Genuinely thoughtful post: 104
    Troll: 305
    Whine: 27
    Rejected due to not fitting into the above categories: 2055

    Please note that your vague reference to the article nearly got your post rejected. Try to be more like the other people in your category in the future.

    Thank you for your effort. Without dedicated individuals like you phoning in your bitter, fill-in-the-blanks-esque posts, Slashdot wouldn't be what it is today.

    Thank you.
    -The Slashdot Mechanism
  • Re:Ironically... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by VanillaCoke420 ( 662576 ) <.vanillacoke420. .at. .hotmail.com.> on Sunday February 06, 2005 @04:31AM (#11588495)
    I bet some people will buy it just for fun.
  • Re:oh thats easy (Score:4, Insightful)

    by altstadt ( 125250 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @04:58AM (#11588569)

    It may have seemed plausible, but man was it ever fucking boring. I'm glad I didn't pay to read any of them. I only read the third one because of inertia, something that will never be repeated for the third Dune prequel.

  • Nice spin. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by rjh ( 40933 ) <rjh@sixdemonbag.org> on Sunday February 06, 2005 @05:19AM (#11588631)
    Sokal, through deliberate fraud...
    Such as writing a paper that he knew was bogus, in order to see whether or not Social Text would publish it?
    and playing on his legitimate reputation within physics, got the Social Text editors to publish an article that they themselves did not think was of high quality.
    The very fact he was able to do that at all is strong evidence that the Social Text editors are incompetent.

    I'm a graduate student, the lowest rung of professional academic, in a hard discipline. Before I submit a paper anywhere, I submit preprints to experts within whatever field I'm writing about. I do this because I know the journals will do the exact same thing, and it's far better on my reputation if my reviewers find them than if the journal finds them. I know that it doesn't matter if my name is Alan Matheson Turing or Paul Erdoes--whatever I or anyone else submits goes through a formal vetting process which involves having experts pore over my paper with a magnifying glass.

    The Sokal Hoax had glaring errors, errors so large that a college senior in mathematics, economics or physics could have spotted them--not only spotted them, but conclusively proven them to be false.

    Social Text didn't catch this. Does it really matter if they thought the paper was of poor quality? They published it, and by publishing it put their imprimatur on it. "Here," they said to the academic world, "read this, we think it's worth your time."

    Social Text was right. It was worth my time, in that it demonstrated to me precisely why I'm going for a Ph.D. in a discipline where rigor and peer review actually mean something.
  • Da Vinci? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Kadmos ( 793363 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @06:13AM (#11588746)
    If we are going to be talking about absolute crap, somebody should mention "The Da Vinci Code".

    There is a reason it's called "pulp fiction" people. Pulp is what your brain turns into.
  • by Spacejock ( 727523 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @06:24AM (#11588770)
    Andrew Burt, the owner of the site which I linked to, wrote one of the chapters in the book we're all talking about. He runs critters, an SF/F critique group, which is also hosted on the site where the PDF is stored.

    I'm an author myself, so I'm hardly going to link to illegal copies of books floating around the web.

    As the link no longer works, perhaps he and the other authors involved just realised they have a potential best-seller on their hands and asked aburt to remove the PDF so they can cash in. If so, more power to them. On the other hand, perhaps he took the PDF down because their server is melting under a slashdot-induced feeding frenzy. It's almost 600kb, and a few hundred thousand simultaneous downloads would be painful.
  • Re:Nothing new... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by tm2b ( 42473 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @06:56AM (#11588833) Journal
    Do you understand that the behavior that you're describing from the _Social Text_ editors is the very antithesis of peer review?

    An intellectually honest journal will NEVER rely upon the credentials or reputation of a paper's author.

    What Sokal did was actually science: he formed a hypothesis ("The _Social Text_ editors don't know what they're talking about"), made a prediction ("so they will accept bogus papers"), and tested that prediction. And then he published his results, much to the _Social Text_ editors' chagrin.

    He behaved exactly as scientists do when they wish to investigate something. Had the _Social Text_ editors not been charlatans, they would not have even been harmed by this experiment.
  • by Eryximachus ( 819128 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @07:04AM (#11588855)
    Your complaint is an example of its own subject. Complaining about Group Think is part of the Group Think, I think.
  • Re:Da Vinci? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Kadmos ( 793363 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @08:04AM (#11588975)
    It's not so much the story or the religious aspect of the book that I dislike. It's the quality of the writing that makes me gag (though I have seen worse). I imagine Slashdot won't approve of my position (given that the book is so popular), people get upset when somebody doesn't like their "you have *got* to read it" book of the month.

    "The Da Vinci Code" sure does sell, but I don't see it winning any literary awards. There is quality and there is quantity, where the Da Vinci code fits in is an exercise for the reader (that's code for: I'm not game to trash it any more).

    Not surprisingly, his previous unknown works are now selling quite well.

    I blame my wife: I can't read or watch mainstream "entertainment" anymore eg hollywood blockbuster films and the majority of pulp fiction. Over Christmas I picked up a reader copy of a "best selling"/popular author, one which I had read a few works of previously, and couldn't get past the first chapter it was written so badly. The trouble with reading good literature is that reading anything below par becomes almost unbearable.

    Still, the above is only my opinion. If you like the book, I'm glad, at least your reading something...
  • Re:Da Vinci? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by KontinMonet ( 737319 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @08:19AM (#11588997) Homepage Journal
    The da Vinci Code is utter tripe - and I don't have a religious bone in my body. Dan Brown also wrote almost exactly the same book, called it "Angels and Demons" with the same characters, the same plot, very similar errors about scientific institutions but it was set mainly in Rome.

    The pot-boiler writing is irritating enough without the wildly erroneous 'science'. Indeed, the 'science' in A&D is so laughable no one could be fooled by it. For example, the Big Bang was caused by [taa, daaa] ... wait for it ... antimatter!
  • Re:Da Vinci? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by BenjyD ( 316700 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @08:37AM (#11589031)
    It's readable enough, but it is hackneyed and in general not well written. It overuses devices like cliffhanger chapter endings and foreshadowing, more like some bad soap opera than a novel.

    Think "Days of our Lives" in Friends: close-up on character's face as they make a horrifying realisation, background music swells to jarring chord, fade to black and "To be continued...". It works a few times, it just gets annoying after a while.

    I know it's pulp fiction, but there's far better pulp fiction out there: early Michael Crichton, for example.
  • Re:Nothing new... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Ohreally_factor ( 593551 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @08:46AM (#11589045) Journal
    Do you understand that the behavior that you're describing from the _Social Text_ editors is the very antithesis of peer review?

    Just for the record, Social Text is not peer reviewed, nor did it ever claim to be. Quite the opposite. However, they could still have checked the science.

    The only thing that Alan Sokal's credentials got him (and should have gotten him) was his foot in the door of Social Text. The reason they published his parody was because it pandered to their ideological bias.

    The grandparent poster unfortunately has let the academic apologists of Social Text brainwash her (or him), rather than examine the evidence objectively.

    Had the _Social Text_ editors not been charlatans, they would not have even been harmed by this experiment.

    Had they not been charlatans, they would have admitted their goof and engaged in some self reflection. Instead, they circled the wagons.
  • by Etherwalk ( 681268 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @08:57AM (#11589069)

    It's easy to forget that there are real people whose dreams are being taken advantage of here. Not the publish america people- but their authors. Some of the rationalizations they come up with to explain the sting:

    http://www.publishamerica.com/cgi-bin/pamessageboa rd/data/lounge/7434.htm [publishamerica.com]
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 06, 2005 @09:33AM (#11589163)
    So maybe you're getting more hip than the Slashdot crowd. I'm not joking here.. I think Slashdot has been slipping for a while. It may happen slowly, but face it--the Slashdot maintainers are milking their site and NOT investing the time they really should into the project. Article quality is simply one result. Look at the site design, it has been mostly static for years and the look is very aged at this point. Still uses tables, doesnt it?

    Slashdot had all this momentum behind it, but our Dear Leaders here sort of took their money and abandoned the project. They've never taken a view of constant improvement, but more often a view of good enough and maximum profit. The only real design changes have been the addition of ads and subscriptions.

    So you use sites like Boing Boing to get your news now... so do lots of us. I do wish, however, that Boing Boing would reduce the number of sex ads and tone down some of the other advertising.

  • Re:Nothing new... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Aardpig ( 622459 ) on Sunday February 06, 2005 @11:04AM (#11589457)

    They deferred to someone who really was in a position to share expert knowledge, and put it in a context of postmodernist theory.

    But that's the whole point of peer review: you find someone who is expert enough to judge the new work.

    Your drivel is written like a true postmodernist. On the one hand, you feel in a position to make pronouncements about subjects you know nothing about. And on the other hand, you deflect all criticisms of postmodernism, on the grounds that they are made by non-experts. Funny how postmodernists claim that science is a cultural construct, but tend to be recalcitrant about applying the same conclusion to their own analyses.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday February 06, 2005 @12:07PM (#11589846)
    What matters isn't that they felt something was up, but that they published it. If they 'smelled the fish was bad' they shouldn't have published. There's not exactly a lot of integrity in rushing to press because the article was written by a scientist. If the standards of Social Text were anything like a decent scientific journal, reviewers would have taken it out to the trash until it was at least evaluable.

    The tenets of postmodernism can change or not. From what standpoint are you going to argue that they are 'true'? If I accept these tenets, there's no point in them. If I don't accept them, it's pretty clear that postmodernist attacks on science are just penis envy from a pseudofield which has no purpose except to give people jobs. Truth is, there are real criticisms of every particular scientific study or conclusion, which have nothing to do with privilege or dogma, but which require some kind of literacy to deal with. But why bother if you can just spout some general blanket claim about science without even grasping the point? Postmodernism is a great existence proof for 'fooling some of the people all of the time,' though.
  • by c ( 8461 ) <beauregardcp@gmail.com> on Sunday February 06, 2005 @12:26PM (#11589981)
    Bruce walked around any more. Some people might ought to her practiced eye, at her.

    Might have been written by computer, but it reads like it was translated through The Fish a few times...

    c.

  • Re:Nothing new... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by belmolis ( 702863 ) <billposer.alum@mit@edu> on Sunday February 06, 2005 @01:40PM (#11590495) Homepage

    As other posters have already shown, my characterization of the Sokal Hoax was entirely accurate. The only deception on the part of Sokal was that he did not explicitly inform the editors of Social Text, at the time he submitted the paper, that he did not sincerely believe in its content. That was of course necessary in order to carry out his experiment. Since the good of demonstrating that the emperor has no clothes outweighs a minor and temporary deception, I consider his behavior to have been ethical. The paper wore its falsehood on its sleeve. The errors in it were not subtle but would easily be detected by anyone with a basic knowledge of science. The quotations of and references to, postmodern writings were all genuine and accurate, from major figures.

    There is no evidence that Sokal does not understand "science studies", nor is there any evidence other than the self-serving post hoc whining of the editors, that they did not consider the paper to be credible but published it anyway. If this is true, they failed in their duty as editors, which is either only to publish work that they believe to be credible or, in the event that special circumstances motivate publication of something that they do not believe to be credible, to publish it with a disclaimer.

    The ignorance of science and the philosophy of science exhibited by the editors of Social Text is not atypical. I have had the misfortune of having to deal directly with such people in my own (not current) department. One such person, who taught graduate courses on "fundamentals" and purported to be an expert on the philosophy of her field, turned out to be familiar ONLY with postmodern critiques of science. She has never read any of the work that she and they criticize, nor even works that she cites, such as those of Feyerabend. Postmodern "science studie" have the same relationship to serious philosophy and history of science as Creationism does to real biology.

    Wikipedia is very useful, but this is an excellant example of how it can be corrupted by fanatics.

  • Re:Da Vinci? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by arafel ( 15551 ) * on Sunday February 06, 2005 @07:31PM (#11592693)
    > What's wrong with da Vinci?

    Apart from the fact it's unreadable, due to Dan Brown's utter incompetance as a writer?

    Although, to be fair, it might be better than "Digital Fortress".

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