Dead Parrot Sketch Is 1,600 Years Old 276
laejoh writes "Monty Python's 'Dead Parrot sketch' — which featured John Cleese — is some 1,600 years old.
A classic scholar has proved the point, by unearthing a Greek version of the world-famous piece.
A comedy duo called Hierocles and Philagrius told the original version, only rather than a parrot they used a slave.
It concerns a man who complains to his friend that he was sold a slave who dies in his service.
His companion replies: 'When he was with me, he never did any such thing!'
The joke was discovered in a collection of 265 jokes called Philogelos: The Laugh Addict, which dates from the fourth century AD.
Hierocles had gone to meet his maker, and Philagrius had certainly ceased to be, long before John Cleese and Michael Palin reinvented the yarn in 1969."
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Classics, not just stuffy rhetoric or dull hist (Score:3, Interesting)
I'll have to check them out when I have time.
What I find really interesting is the graffiti from those times. Stuff about elections, dirty jokes (which you'd still find funny today), and so on.
Re:so that's what killed it (Score:3, Interesting)
And what does John Cleese have to say about this?
Suetonius made me change my mind. (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Classics, not just stuffy rhetoric or dull hist (Score:4, Interesting)
When I was much younger I was turned on to the classics after reading Lysistrata. Quick synopsis from Wikipedia:
Led by the title character, Lysistrata, the story's female characters barricade the public funds building and withhold sex from their husbands to end the Peloponnesian War and secure peace.
The euphemisms and innuendo are killer, especially to a young teen :)
Re:Classics, not just stuffy rhetoric or dull hist (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Classics, not just stuffy rhetoric or dull hist (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Classics, not just stuffy rhetoric or dull hist (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Suetonius made me change my mind. (Score:4, Interesting)
Twelve Ceasars made me realize that political muck-raking has existed for as long as humans could say "Oog pals around with Neanderthals!"
Claudius got a mild thumbs down from Suetonius, which lead to Robert Graves to "correct the record".
Also Emperor Tiberius was the original Michael Jackson [uchicago.edu].
It's older than that, folks. (Score:5, Interesting)
Ovid had a humorous poem about a dead parrot long before this play was ever written, complete with the long-winded and repetitive description of exactly how dead the parrot is which characterizes Monty Python's sketch.
This was itself a parody of a poem by Catullus, lamenting the death of his lover's "sparrow." The quotes are there for a reason; it's the term he used, but modern poets would probably have used a more, err, feline term to catch the nuance, if you know what I mean (wink and a nudge, say no more, say no more).
Monty Python was made up of some extremely erudite people; even Sir Not-Appearing-In-This-Film actually corresponds to someone from Arthurian legend (and bonus points if you can tell me who). No doubt they drew inspiration from the Ovid poem too, among others, and is there really any problem with that? It's friggin funny.
Re:Not the same joke (Score:4, Interesting)
Monty Python is treated as more absurdist than they really were by American audiences. A lot of the objects of their humor were aspects of British life, politics and culture that would be recognizable to viewers in the UK, particularly at the time. Which is why British comedy moved on decades ago (The League of Gentlemen, Little Britain, The Catherine Tate Show, and the brilliant That Mitchell and Webb Look.)
When an American geeks constantly recycle the same handful of Monty Python routines, it's depressing. It's humor-by-algorithm: if it was funny once, the memory of the experience of that humor displaces the actual spontaneity and discovery of new sources of humor in a kind of compulsive repetition, which I think is meant more to reassure geeks than to amuse them.
Norwegian Blue Parrot (Score:3, Interesting)
Of course part of the absurd humour in the Monty Python sketch is that there are no parrots in Scandinavia. But Monty Python probably should have expected this story: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1958285/Monty-Python's-dead-parrot-did-exist.html [telegraph.co.uk]. Basicly, Norwegian parrots did exist 55 million years ago, even though it is not known if they were blue...
From the link: Michael Palin was amused when told about the discovery, saying: "All I can say is that it just shows that nothing is original."
Re:Not the same joke (Score:1, Interesting)
I am in my 50's and I definitely remember a Lil Abner (by Al Capp) Saturday morning newspaper cartoon where the world's funniest jokwe was invented and used by the Allies against the Germans. This would have been in the late 1960's. So, Python possibly ripped that one, too.
Re:Not the same joke (Score:3, Interesting)
You're probably right that as social commentary and topical political satire, Monty Python is pretty generic and disposable, outdated and long since superceded by more relevant acts. But their unique genius in juxtaposing the silly and ridiculous with the serious, dignified and refined is ageless and universal. I re-watch the Flying Circus episodes every five years or so and they continue to be hilarious. Perhaps foreign stereotypes of English personalities help to accentuate the absurdity.
As in all comedy performance, it's not what they do but how they do it that is so special. In the late 1960s Cleese, Idle, and Chapman were at the peak of their ability and worked brilliantly together, creating art that (IMHO) will last forever.
Re:Never the same again (Score:3, Interesting)
it wasn't just the Mithras that was copied from--and it wasn't just Christianity that copied from other religions for that matter. the story of Noah's Ark found in Judeo-Christian & Muslim literature seems to have been adapted from the Epic of Gilgamesh from Sumerian legends dating back to the 17th century BC.
Re:Not the same joke at all (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes, it would -- because the funny part of the Monty Python sketch is that it's basically about trying too hard.
The shopkeeper is trying to convince the patron that everything is all right, that he doesn't need to make a fuss. He is a bit of a cheat in that he sold a dead parrot as a live one, but likewise the customer is a bit of a fool for buying it. But by the middle of the sketch it is clear that the shopkeeper is merely trying much too hard to recuperate a failing social situation: the patron is not going to be fooled again, and the shopkeeper's desperate, inventive, and doomed attempts to maintain a polite and friendly atmosphere, while continuing to insist that nothing is wrong (that the parrot is alive) are much of the humor.
For the shopkeeper to admit that the parrot is dead, as in the Greek joke, would be to spoil the scene.
(I get the sense that many Python fans think the sketch is about the patron's widely-quoted rant. I disagree.)
A lot of Monty Python is like that: the humor is in how a perfectly ordinary and unfunny event becomes an outrageous farce after something goes very wrong, because someone in the situation simply refuses to admit that anything is out of the ordinary. It's all about how pretending that everything is okay makes you into a total buffoon.
Re:Not the same joke at all (Score:3, Interesting)
In other words, a new "Windows Vista capable" PC is officially certified by Microsoft as being capable of running Vista ...
... apart from any parts of Vista that may turn out not be capable of running on that machine's hardware.
Those parts won't work, obviously.