Jedi-ism Becomes a Serious Religion 268
An anonymous reader writes: 390,127 Brits declared their religion as Jediism in their last census — many as a joke, but some are quite serious, the BBC reports. Cambridge University Divinity Faculty researcher Beth Singler estimates at least 2,000 of them are "genuine," around the same number as the Church of Scientology. The U.K. Church of Jediism has 200,000 members worldwide. Their belief system has expanded well beyond the Star Wars universe to include tenets from Taoism, Buddhism, Catholicism and Samurai. Former priest, psychotherapist and writer Mark Vernon finds real power in the Jedi story: "The reason it's so powerful and universal is that we have to find ourselves. It's by losing ourselves and identifying with something greater like the Jedi myth that we find a fuller life."
Spiritual Needs (Score:5, Interesting)
"For Mark Vernon, a former priest, psychotherapist and writer, says the Jedi story has real power. "The reason it's so powerful and universal is that we have to find ourselves. It's by losing ourselves and identifying with something greater like the Jedi myth that we find a fuller life."
Speak for yourself
Re:Spiritual Needs (Score:4, Insightful)
It seems to me that people without a strong sense of identity are finding something to give them one.
Re: Spiritual Needs (Score:2, Insightful)
It seems to me that part of the attraction of the Jedi story is the juvenile need to identify with a master breed, individuals with semi-magical capabilities beyond those of the general population. It's psychologically understandable in some 14 year old trying to find his personal identity, but sad in an adult.
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It seems to me that part of the attraction of the Christian story is the juvenile need to identify with a master breed, individual with semi-magical capabilities beyond those of the general population. It's psychologically understandable in some 14 year old trying to find his personal identity, but sad in an adult.
You can replace Christian with Muslim and it still works too.
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You're advocating violence to "educate" and show superiority? Once you start down the path to the Dark Side, yada yada...
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I find the Prophet Lee Ving was on target with his observations;
Fundamental
Gun controllers
Right to lifers
Holy rollers
Searching for identity it's clear,
Everybody needs to believe in something
I believe I'll have another beer
Fags in combat
Bus in schools
More bullshit
From liberal fools
Ain't got a snowballs chance in hell
For an idea
Everybody needs to believe in something
I believe I'll have another beer
That's way to fast
The truth cuts to close
You can't sell that
On either coast
Gotta write about romance
To get rich t
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Yeah, copy and paste has made me a victim more than once.
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It seems to me that people without a strong sense of identity are finding something to give them one.
Even those with a strong sense of identity sometimes need comfort, or vent a bit, or be thankful etc.
Personally I pray to the classic Greek pantheon. Of course I know it's not real. But it's as good a way as any. So I thank Hera for the fact that I've got a healthy daughter, and I thank Hephaestus for a good day's work.
I don't give a shit that it's all imaginary. Thanks to science, I know that thankfulness and praying is proven to make people happier. And unfortunately, with my normal mood naturally below a
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It seems to me that, whatever the undiscoverable truth is, our spiritual needs have no power over it.
In other words, God is there but not because you need it, or God isn't there but not because you don't need it.
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So, it's as real as any other religion.
Re:Spiritual Needs (Score:5, Insightful)
Religion gives people who need a purpose in their life one. Some people find one without religion, others are happy without one. But then there's those that need one, can't find one themselves and for them, religion may well fill that void. That's fine and ok, as long as they leave me out of it, and that includes leaving the tenets of their imaginary friend out of anything that may affect me, be it education, legislation or noise in the form of people screaming I should go to prayer or bells ringing in my ears.
In other words, faith is something lovely, just don't make a religion out of it.
Re:Spiritual Needs (Score:4, Insightful)
... faith is something lovely ...
Faith, in the religious sense, is the belief in something without evidence, and the preservation of that belief in the face of contradictory evidence. Some very smart people have faith in a religion and are completely aware that their beliefs have no evidence to back them up, but still believe and act as though they're true. Whether they're right or wrong about the religion is irrelevant, the fact that they're willing to believe it without evidence is problematic – not lovely.
You'll find it quite difficult to find a religious person who doesn't allow their religion to influence the way they act when they have a choice in something to do with education or legislation. There might be a few smart ones around here, but the overwhelming majority will take the words of their religious leaders very seriously and attempt to promote those. It's not fine to allow those people to promote those views without backing them up like the rest of us must.
Faith without evidence is toxic, faith with evidence isn't faith.
Re:Spiritual Needs (Score:4, Insightful)
Faith without evidence is toxic, faith with evidence isn't faith.
That makes sense only with this prepended:
Faith, in the religious sense,
But I feel you put those two far too apart.
Faith is something all people have naturally. People just have it.
Religion is simply a parasite which attaches to it. And that can make the faith toxic.
Cut the crap, this is not insightful (Score:3)
[rant on] It really gets tiresome reading the same drivel over and over and seeing it marked as "insightful" when it is simply repeating statements that are provably false. It's like watching the KKK guys all pat each other on the back for using a racial slur, it's old and pathetic. [rant off]
Consider Pascal's wager. Even if there is no God, what is the harm in society practicing Christian beliefs? Thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, thou shalt not covet they neighbors wife or property.
7 out of 1
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Consider Pascal's wager. Even if there is no God, what is the harm in society practicing Christian beliefs?
What if the is a god, but not a Christian God?
Pascal's Wager only works if there isn't a god. If there is a god, but you pick the wrong religion, you're just as boned as if you simply don't believe. If multiple religions claim to be True, and none can offer real evidence, logically you should believe in none of them.
Hell, even if it is the God of the Christian bible, but the stuff that Christian ignore in the OT really are important (Suffer not a witch to live, shellfish is an abomination, if a farmer mixes
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Faith without evidence is not always toxic. It depends on what that faith is in. Point to me a devout Buddhist who is somehow toxic. or one who has ever existed.
The problem with religion has nothing at all to do with faith - for the most part it has to do with monotheism and the dogma around it, most notably the Abrahamic religions. All of the violence and wars throughout history caused by religion have a direct connection to monotheism because these religions invariably have as part of their dogma that the
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Faith without evidence is not always toxic. It depends on what that faith is in. Point to me a devout Buddhist who is somehow toxic. or one who has ever existed.
http://time.com/3090990/how-an... [time.com]
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But, but, but, they weren't true Buddhists - true Buddhists wouldn't do something like that!
Because nothing wins an argument like the No True Scotsman fallacy.
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This shows an abysmal ignorance of religions in history. There is no religion that has been immune from the human a
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Point to me a devout Buddhist who is somehow toxic. or one who has ever existed.
How about this? [wikipedia.org] Literally toxic.
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I take it you are never going to be married. Faith is trusting someone else's decisions no matter the situation and being okay with the end result.
When you marry you express faith and trust in your spouse. You may or may not have the evidence to prove your faith.
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Faith, in the religious sense, is the belief in something without evidence, and the preservation of that belief in the face of contradictory evidence.
I thought that the former was called "faith" whereas the latter was called "delusion"? Faith despite contradictory evidence isn't faith anymore.
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I always found it funny that we learned about Roman and Greek gods / divine beings as mythological but our god, oh, he's definitely real!
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I dare you to cite at least one solid example that should put me startled into place for assuming otherwise. Otherwise, you're just another one of those holier-than-thou folks with nothing to show for it.
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I too would love an example. I'm genuinely intrigued.
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I believe that SSL keys are unique, too. It's math, not faith.
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please do enlighten us. I would love to know of even one example of something I "believe" in without evidence.
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Drugs gives people who need a purpose in their life one. Some people find one without drugs, others are happy without one. But then there's those that need one, can't find one themselves and for them, drugs may well fill that void. That's fine and ok, as long as they leave me out of it, and that includes leaving the tenets of their imaginary friend out of anything that may affect me, be it education, legislation or noise in the form of people screaming I should go to prayer or bells ringing in my ears.
In other words, drugs is something lovely, just don't make a drug out of it.
Sex gives people who need a purpose in their life one. Some people find one without sex, others are happy without one. But then there's those that need one, can't find one themselves and for them, sex may well fill that void. That's fine and ok, as long as they leave me out of it, and that includes leaving the tenets of their imaginary friend out of anything that may affect me, be it education, legislation or noise in the form of people screaming I should go to prayer or bells ringing in my ears.
In other words, sex is something lovely, just don't make sex out of it.
A good job gives people who need a purpose in their life one. Some people find one without a good job, others are happy without one. But then there's those that need one, can't find one themselves and for them, a good job may well fill that void. That's fine and ok, as long as they leave me out of it, and that includes leaving the tenets of their imaginary friend out of anything that may affect me, be it education, legislation or noise in the form of people screaming I should go to prayer or bells ringing in my ears.
In other words, a good job is something lovely, just don't make a good job out of it.
Marriage gives people who need a purpose in their life one. Some people find one without marriage, others are happy without one. But then there's those that need one, can't find one themselves and for them, marriage may well fill that void. That's fine and ok, as long as they leave me out of it, and that includes leaving the tenets of their imaginary friend out of anything that may affect me, be it education, legislation or noise in the form of people screaming I should go to prayer or bells ringing in my ears.
In other words, a spouse is something lovely, just don't make a marriage out of it.
A cat gives people who need a purpose in their life one. Some people find one without a cat, others are happy without one. But then there's those that need one, can't find one themselves and for them, a cat may well fill that void. That's fine and ok, as long as they leave me out of it, and that includes leaving the tenets of their imaginary friend out of anything that may affect me, be it education, legislation or noise in the form of people screaming I should go to prayer or bells ringing in my ears.
In other words, a cat is something lovely, just don't make a pet out of it.
Posting vacuous comments on Slashdot gives people who need a purpose in their life one. Some people find one without posting vacuous comments on Slashdot , others are happy without one. But then there's those that need one, can't find one themselves and for them, posting vacuous comments on Slashdot may well fill that void. That's fine and ok, as long as they leave me out of it, and that includes leaving the tenets of their imaginary friend out of anything that may affect me, be it education, legislation or noise in the form of people screaming I should go to prayer or bells ringing in my ears.
In other words, stupidity is something lovely, just don't make vacuous comments on out of it.
FTFY
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Your point being? You forgot to append what the whole diatribe was supposed to prove.
Midichlorians (Score:5, Funny)
Good luck with your Midichlorian count.
Or is he Orthodox Jedi? I think they reject the prequels as heresy.
Or is that Reformed Jedi?
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But, just to balance the discussion, whenever Christians and Muslims and other people like that point out "but where do you find spiritual experience and meaning of life?", it's nice to point out that there's a new detox available for Abrahamic addicts.
And I guess it could also serve as a good tool for reductio ad absurdum argumentation against established religions.
Retards (Score:3)
The Jedi were, in the end, a bunch of idiots who were so blind that they (1) didn't notice they were spending billions of credits a year building a clone army, (2) didn't realize, even after some kid mentioned it to yoda, that all their systems were compromised, and (3) were so bad at tactics that they dropped 100% of their forces into - some dumb arena to fight someone.
Their last practitioner, Obi-Wan, left his best friend to die after cutting off both of his arms and his legs, and spent the rest of his l
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Exactly. And not just speaking for others but suggesting it was some kind of universal truth.
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Serious Religion... (Score:4, Insightful)
As if there were one :P
Re:Serious Religion... (Score:5, Insightful)
Oh no, many of them are serious. That's the real problem.
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Millions of people have been murdered in the name of religions.
Millions of people have been brain washed in the name of religions.
Millions of people have had their freedom to think what they want, feel what they want, or express what they want in the name of religions.
Most modern governments enforce law that is heavily based on religious roots within their history.
You may not think it's serious, but the entire world around you has been shaped by these religions, as sad and terrifying as it is.
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Have you ever noticed how all weapons are physical objects? Clearly the only logical implication to draw from this is that all physical objects are evil.
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I may have bad news for you regarding your ontological status, provided you are not a ghost, spirit, or otherwise disembodied soul.
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So, your point is that religion and communism have both been a pox on humanity?
That is somewhere we can start a conversation.
is it worth the effort ? (Score:3)
390,127 Brits declared their religion as Jediism
vs.
at least 2,000 of them are "genuine,"
doesn't the difference seem a bit high ?
If they assume that roughly 0.5% of the answers are genuine, I wonder what they think about other statements from that census.
If you have to assume that less than a percent of the answers are genuine the whole thing doesn't really seem to be worth the effort.
(or the goal of the census was quite a different one than one would suspect)
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You can probably find 2000 people that declare Kermit the Frog to be their personal savior. It's a statistical blip that essentially rounds down to zero. However, Star Wars is incredibly popular. So, no, that seems about the right proportional difference between fans playing a joke on the census takers and the genuine oddballs.
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As it happens, Miss Piggy and Yoda are both the puppets of Frank Oz.
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390,127 Brits declared their religion as Jediism
vs.
at least 2,000 of them are "genuine,"
How many declared their religion to be "Sith"? The NSA should be monitoring those people.
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I thought it was always 2?
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The true dark side is Islam
[citation needed]
...and that would be a citation that proves Islam, and only Islam, to be "truly" dark. Good luck with that, jagoff.
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Oh fuck off. Take your bigotry and shove it up your ass. Every religion is the dark side. :)
The problem is that in Islam there is a very large dark side, and the majority of followers either support it or are quiet about it.
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The problem is that in Islam there is a very large dark side, and the majority of followers either support it or are quiet about it.
Just like Catholicism. If I had my choice, I'd flush both books down the same toilet.
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people get pissed off with certain questions where they (rightly in my opinion) believe it is none of the governments business what I do or don't believe in and hence such questions insight a much higher rate of bullshit answers, When I am forced to do the census I also lie my arse off on questions I think they have no right to know the answer too.
Use the force? (Score:2)
Stop it. (Score:2, Insightful)
Neither is Scientology a church nor are they are a religion or serious. They are a serious criminal company having bullied IRS to conduct their enslaving scam tax free.
Samurai were people (Score:3)
not a belief system. Some followed "the way of the samurai" (really neo-confuscianism), and others were (zen) buddhist or shinto adherents, often at the same time.
Slashdotism . . . (Score:3)
Wars of religion . . . (Score:5, Funny)
Nah, Slashdot is not a religion. But you could for example choose one of the many religions organizations represented on Slashdot like: the Sacred Temple of the Apple, the Revered and Holy Shrine of the Android, the Evangelical Church of Emacs, the First Reformed Church of Vim, the Orthodox Church of WIndows or the Open Source Church of the Blessed Saint Linux on the Desktop ... the list goes on ... those are already established religions. Slashdot is more like the plains of Armageddon where the adherents of these faiths fight their wars of religion.
crap (Score:2)
Putting aside the quality, is there really sufficient quantity of material in the six films to produce any more than the sketchiest overview?
You might as well watch the Avengers cartoons and invent a religion called "Ironmanism".
It's the kind of shit you do in an evening at the pub or for a GCSE media studies essay when you just can't be arsed.
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I hope you understand that there is a lot more than six films out there involving star wars. Quite a bit more actually.
A lot of it is fan fiction but a lot is sanctioned too.
That being said, i am not sure it invalidates your premiss.
at least 2,000 of them are "genuine," (Score:3)
Have they demonstrated the power of the force at all? or are they just genuine nutters?
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Have they demonstrated the power of the force at all? or are they just genuine nutters?
Couldn't you ask the same question of all other religions since the dawn of time, and reach the same conclusion?
Jedi is not an "ism" (Score:3)
The proper name is "Jedi". It is both the name of one who practices the religion as well as the religion itself.
"I studied Jedi at a Jedi Institute, to work towards becoming a Jedi"
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The difference is that that "Jedi" was entirely fictional.
Oh, wait,....
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Obviously they can't call it Jediism. That'd be a clear case of trademark infringement.
They'd be hit with a cease and desist notice quicker than you could say "Oy vey already!"
Observation (Score:2)
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Enough believers for a schism? (Score:5, Funny)
Are the jedists a large enough group to start killing each other over the "Old Testament" (episodes 4, 5, 6) vs. "New Testament" (episodes 1, 2, 3, with the midichlorians)?
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Not yet. But once we are, the Midichlorian Heresy will be purged...
The Power and the Glory (Score:2)
Here is an example of one of the solemn rites of Jedi-ism as performed by one of their high priests.
http://youtu.be/HPPj6viIBmU [youtu.be]
Test for authentic Jedi (Score:2)
As long as they're willing to prove they really know about the Jedi identity.
By telling us what they did to piss off the Sith.
Of course They Do. (Score:2)
As Umberto Eco wrote [telegraph.co.uk]:
"G K Chesterton is often credited with observing: "When a man ceases to believe in God, he doesn't believe in nothing. He believes in anything." Whoever said it - he was right. We are supposed to live in a sceptical age. In fact, we live in an age of outrageous credulity.
"The "death of God", or at least the dying of the Christian God, has been accompanied by the birth of a plethora of new idols. They have multiplied like bacteria on the corpse of the Christian Church ..."
So they are Hindus now... (Score:2)
Their belief system has expanded well beyond the Star Wars universe to include tenets from Taoism, Buddhism, Catholicism and Samurai
That many Gods and philosophies? They are Hindus now. Hindus who believe Shiva is the only God and all other gods are Shiva's manifestations would happily coexist and accept the Vishnu worshipers who do
sed -e 's/Shiva/Vishnu/g' shiva_theology > vishnu_theology They can accept all of the above and jediism without any problems.
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Kopimism (Score:2)
Spelling (Score:2)
Jediism, Judaism.... how many people just checked the wrong box?
These are not ... (Score:2)
Re:What do you mean? (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't be offended. Lots of religions start out as jokes or satire, before inexplicably being taken seriously.
If you ever read the Book of Mormon, or Dianetics, you will see what I mean.
It could be time to re-label those E-Meters as midichlorian meters, and make a fortune.
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This religion started out as a joke, and remains a joke [principiadiscordia.com]. (Thank Goddess.)
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I personally know Dawayne Baily, their current guitar wizard. I'd put him over Satch or Vai , any day. Call it bias.
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oops Bailey.
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Indeed, one of the best ideas for calendars ever. 5 seasons is reasonable, ~73 days is not perfectly round, but 30/31/28 is strange, too. Now combine it with @beats (1000 beats are one day) and you have an ideal system for measuring time. You just do not get a metric number of days per year, because we would need to change the earth orbit to keep the day and night schedule.
Re:What do you mean? (Score:4, Informative)
The Subgenius Foundation, is SERIOUSLY the only hope you pink nerdlings have of avoiding the Stark Fist of Removal, becoming a God of your own pleasure planet, and having unlimited SLACK! http://www.subgenius.com/ [subgenius.com]
We are the ONLY religion to offer salvation for only $35 U.S. or DOUBLE YOUR MONEY BACK! http://www.subgenius.com/scata... [subgenius.com]
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Pamphlets #1 & 2
Your Own Personal 8x11 suitable-for-framing DOBBSHEAD
Official Dobbshead/Church Logo Metal Pin
Dobbshead Sticker, Bumper Sticker
The SubGenius Pledge
The Divine Excuse (signed by "Bob"!)
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(be a Doktor INSTANTLY. Incredible, sinister super-miniaturized fine print details all the scores of Church Ranks and Titles from which YOU can CHOOSE. Signed by... "Bob")
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The STARK FIST of Removal online / SCRUBGENIUS secret forum
(they're full of rants, art, Prescriptures, doctrine, charts, filth, comics, reviews and CHURCH NEWS & CONTACTS)
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Praise BOB!
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Praise BOB!
Kill Bob!
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Hell, if it's only $35 dollars, I'm in.
Do you take Bitcoins?
And even more... (Score:2)
...advertising campaigns start off soft.
Like a year or so in advance.
Planting stories tangentially related to the product in order to slowly build up awareness and interest among the general population.
Hey! Did you know they are making a new Star Wars movie?!
And it's done by that guy who made that last Star Trek movie everyone loved?!
And it has all the old actors from the original movies, not the new ones from those prequels!
And OH MY GAWD! Did you know that they're gonna put Sherlock the Smaug the Khaaaaaa
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Then the next thing you know they are assassinating political leaders in their chambers all because one of the neophytes 'had an uneasy feeling'.
As on of their prophets said: 'Not afraid? You will be. You *will* be'
From who's perspective? (Score:4, Interesting)
The Mormons and COS were both intended as money making operations to gain power. Hubbard wrote several papers before Dianetics stating that the easiest way to get rich was to start a religion, so he did. To them it was not a joke or satire, it was about money and domination. The story of Mormon religion is similar, but harder to track and requires reading lots of anecdotal evidence.
The masses looking at the founders of these religions for the most part laughed and snickered, but as PT Barnum is attributed with saying "a sucker is born every minute" (re-read that statement before trying to correct the quote)
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According to some westerners who got their hands on Buddhist texts in the last century and decided to cut out what made them uncomfortable. Within the Buddhist tradition, some supernatural element has always been present, even among schools that downplayed anything but direct experience. The Mahayana Buddhism most successful among westerners inherited the entire Vedic pantheon, and in Avatamsakasutra,
Re:Worked for me. (Score:5, Informative)
Most Buddhists would strongly disagree with you.
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But they won't kill you over it.
Re:Worked for me. (Score:5, Interesting)
But they won't kill you over it.
Or more accurately, like most other religious followers, the majority of Buddhists won't kill you for it. Like every religion, it has followers who are willing to kill for their beliefs - Special Report: Buddhist monks incite Muslim killings in Myanmar [reuters.com]
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I read the article closely, and I see threats ("leave me alone or I'll kill her!") and that they incited killing, but it doesn't actually say that any Buddhist monks killed anybody.
I know, it's a fine point, but religion is nothing if not about people trying to find the loopholes to the laws of God.
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Somebody has never heard of the Sohei in Japan and the Shaolin in China? (Shoalin Kung Fu?)
http://jp.learnoutlive.com/the... [learnoutlive.com]
B4 anyone replies - yup, that's Buddhism for you.. (Score:2)
If religions were operating systems, Buddhism would be LFS. LFS [linuxfromscratch.org]
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Other than "they're all a load of baloney".
I'd say that's pretty much got it covered.
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Around these parts Ayn Rand runs pretty close.
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Hello James. Why are you posting as Anonymous Coward?
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