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Movies Television Entertainment

VPN Blockade Backlash Doesn't Hurt Us, Says Netflix (torrentfreak.com) 98

Posted by msmash from the pull-the-blockade-entirely-then dept.
Ernesto Van der Sar, writing for TorrentFreak: Netflix CEO Reed Hastings says that the recent crackdown on VPN and proxy users hasn't hurt the company's results. The VPN blockade only affects a small but vocal minority, according to Hastings, and there are no signs that hordes of subscribers are abandoning ship. Earlier this year Netflix announced that it would increase its efforts to block customers who circumvent geo-blockades. As a result, it has become harder to use VPN services and proxies to access Netflix content from other countries, something various movie studios have repeatedly called for. When asked about the impact of the VPN changes on the results, Hastings brushed the issue aside as a minor detail that doesn't impact the bigger picture in any way. "It's a very small but quite vocal minority. So it's really inconsequential to us, as you could see in the Q1 results." Earlier this year, Hastings also admitted that a VPN-blocking policy might be impossible to enforce.
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VPN Blockade Backlash Doesn't Hurt Us, Says Netflix More

VPN Blockade Backlash Doesn't Hurt Us, Says Netflix

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  • I never once saw any sort of region block and just saw "This title isn't available in the US" yesterday... on a US title!

    • Just because it's a US title doesn't mean the rights holder sold the US distribution rights to Netflix

      • Then Netflix shouldn't put it on my list. Or rather they should dish out for the rights, they've continued to increase prices while dropping more than half their content.

        • Re:This bull (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Mr D from 63 ( 3395377 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @05:05PM (#51943083)

          Then Netflix shouldn't put it on my list. Or rather they should dish out for the rights, they've continued to increase prices while dropping more than half their content.

          You should just stop paying them.

          • Re: (Score:1)

            by Anonymous Coward

            > You should just stop paying them.

            Easy to say, hard to implement.

            I don't know if you're aware of this fact, but English as a language leaves a lot of room for improvement, but it's hard to replace it with something better, because of costs of readapting and past (individual) investments. This is not entirely different from why people still use Windows, being it what it is.

            The best response might be to explore new alternatives with a pool of movies made from all parts of the world, first in a indie way t

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by mjwx ( 966435 )

            Then Netflix shouldn't put it on my list. Or rather they should dish out for the rights, they've continued to increase prices while dropping more than half their content.

            You should just stop paying them.

            Do you know the only reason I haven't stopped paying Netflix A$12 per month... Because I can still access US content.

            If that stopped, yeah I'd go back to Channel BT. Your move content "owners".

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by qe2e! ( 1141401 )
      You read what you wanted to read -- that's not a real error message. "Not not available right now" --- that's a thing. But it never says the country. P.s. you get that message when your internet sucks or when the implementation sucks (e.g. that black friday blu-ray player)...

  • Small and inconsequential (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Macdude ( 23507 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @04:45PM (#51942939)

    If it's small and inconsequential, why bother blocking it at all?

    • Re:Small and inconsequential (Score:5, Insightful)

      by MightyMartian ( 840721 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @04:48PM (#51942963) Journal

      Because the rights holders demand it. It's the only way Netflix can guarantee they'll continue being allowed to show their content.

      • Re:Small and inconsequential (Score:5, Insightful)

        by dmbasso ( 1052166 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @04:59PM (#51943037)

        Because the rights holders demand it.

        And it seems it's inconsequential to them as well. And from that we can extrapolate and say that those users, that were willing to pay but now are probably going to get the content by illegal means, doesn't really matter. It's a win-win-win scenario!

        • Most people won't bother to get the content by illegal means - they'll just watch something else from Netflix.

          • Re: (Score:1)

            by Anonymous Coward

            You're saying "most people" when these people are already not "most people" they are already the minority. So why do you think what most people do can be applied to this minority?

            • Until you can prove otherwise, I'll stick with my statement. People are lazy. They are just going to click that remote until they find something interesting from what's available.
              • Except that these people have already demonstrated that they are non-lazy enough to set up a VPN so they can watch Netflix as if they are from another country. If they are going to go through that much trouble in the first place, why would they now just watch something else on Netflix when the VPN no longer works. Wouldn't they have just done that to start with and not even bother with the VPN?
                • Contrary to what people want to believe, they ARE making progress in blocking VPNs. It's become a news story in Canada, where unblocking services are closing up shop because they stop working shortly after each time they're unblocked.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by lgw ( 121541 )

            Most people won't bother to get the content by illegal means - they'll just watch something else from Netflix.

            What that software called again, the one that lets you click on a title in the Netflix web UI and immediately torrent it so it starts playing?

          • Haha. If you pay for netflix you might just as well pay 5 bucks more to see all the content on netflix. Netflix only does lip service to rights holders. Per country the list of shows so much... it feels like paying the same as US for 5 percent of content.

          • perhaps you aren't familiar with how limited content is on Netflix in some countries? I and many people I know have cancelled their Netflix membership in Australia, without access to content in the US or one of the other major regions the service is worse than shit, it has a tiny fraction of the content a US user sees. I am sure he is right that people like myself won't affect their bottom line much, but at least I can now have a guilt free conscience as I go back to torrenting as I am not going to play the
            • I'm continually amazed at how much importance their TV viewing is to people. I watch 3 local English and two local French OTA channels, and if there's nothing on that I'm interested (which happens a LOT during hockey season) there are plenty of other things to do.
              • It isn't so much important as a source of entertainment. I don't watch regular TV at all except for some news, but I like to have whatever movie I want on demand whenever I want it. I only watch maybe 3 or 4 a month and hence ease of use and maximum range is important to me otherwise why the hell would I waste $10 on it a month, $10 isn't much, but I could use it to buy entertainment elsewhere and just torrent the few movies I watch if they want to put hurdles in the way of me paying.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

            If they went to the effort of getting a VPN set up to circumvent geoblocking on Netflix, it's a near certainty that they will have the know-how to set up a BitTorrent client and use that same VPN to mask their copyright infringement.

            They have already demonstrated that they don't care about international copyright law by circumventing it with the VPN, even though the Netflix account they are accessing has their real name and billing details on it! I doubt many of them would hesitate to hop over to kat.cr or

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by allo ( 1728082 )

            which doesn't profit the right holder, too.

        • Re: (Score:3)

          by Kjella ( 173770 )

          And it seems it's inconsequential to them as well. And from that we can extrapolate and say that those users, that were willing to pay but now are probably going to get the content by illegal means, doesn't really matter. It's a win-win-win scenario!

          It's the traditional TV networks that care. They're the ones saying "exclusive rights in Kerbeckistan" is no good if the ratings are poor because people see it on Netflix over VPN. Just like the cinema business refuse to show movies that air at the same time, they won't give people cheap watercooler talk. If you want to be "in" on recent movies and not hear spoilers, it's in theaters and only in theaters now.

          Of course one alternative is to go all Netflix, but 76% [variety.com] still pay for traditional cable or satellite

          • I think, in the long run, companies like Netflix and Amazon are going to end acquiring more and more new shows that broadcast monopolies will break down anyways. That will obviously take some time, but with cord cutting on the rise, I think at some point in the next five to ten years the tipping point will be reached. Amazon and Netflix will be aided by the incompetence of the broadcasters, either trying to turning streaming into just another version of the standard broadcast, or with really buggy streaming

      • Re:Small and inconsequential (Score:4, Funny)

        by ewhac ( 5844 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @06:32PM (#51943585) Homepage Journal

        Because the rights holders demand it. It's the only way Netflix can guarantee they'll continue being allowed to show their content.

        Dear Hollywood:

        We have twice the number of subscribers as Comcast. Now shut the fuck up.

        Cordially,
        Netflix

      • Oh ok. I'll see if TPB has it instead.

    • Probably because that small but vocal minority caused issues with the content rights owners.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      BECAUSE IT'S STEALING!!!!

      Everything against the EULA is punishable by DEATH~!!!!

      • Except it is not. i.e. Ran into this very issue over the Winter break:

        While visiting my parents in Canada I couldn't stream Netflix which is bullshit. I live in the US, and NetFlix can tell I have an US account but apparently since "I'm on vacation" I'm not allowed.

        Shenanigans indeed.

    • Re:Small and inconsequential (Score:4, Interesting)

      by Austerity Empowers ( 669817 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @04:54PM (#51943007)

      it's small and inconsequential

      I think they are deluding themselves. What I read is that their VPN region block has been utterly ineffective, except for a small and inconsequential group of people who don't know how to get around their VPN blockade.

      I don't know a single person who was actually stopped by this, but there was a lot of chuckling when it went down.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by AK Marc ( 707885 )
        Hola, one of the largest (because it's free) was successfully blocked. The pay ones were mostly all blocked, but have a pay incentive to fix it, so many did before their users noticed. Now it's an arms race.

      • I think they are deluding themselves. What I read is that their VPN region block has been utterly ineffective, except for a small and inconsequential group of people who don't know how to get around their VPN blockade.

        That inconsequential group of people numbers somewhere around 46 million.

        The VPN is a geek thing --- an added layer of complexity and expense which may or may not work around the block. Simplicity is what sells streaming media, instant access to a broad range of programming, though not necessarily access to every title in the 800 page catalog of Moves Unlimited.

      • I don't know a single person who was actually stopped by this

        Dan Gilmor, who doesn't strike me as neophyte nor a fool.

      • I would not call it inconsequential, they have been systematically blocking all the major providers and cloud providers. While you can easily get around it, many users are finding they are continually having to get around it. If you are going to go to that effort you may as well save $10 a month and just torrent the content.

    • If it's small and inconsequential, why bother blocking it at all?

      Its not significantly affecting their revenue. Which is not hard to believe. If they don't block then they face consequential content licensing issues.

  • just like I did from hulu and any other company who won't let me use vpn. I am sure they collect data and sell it to advertisers which is exactly why I use a vpn

  • I killed my service (Score:4, Interesting)

    by future assassin ( 639396 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @04:52PM (#51943003)

    for blocking Unotelly to access US from Canada. Back to torrents, pawn shops and my 800+ DVD collection. Personally we just watched nature and travel shows and pretty much watched them all by now but fuck em I'll take the $11 and buy weed with it.

  • Hmmm (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward

    I'm a Netflix subscriber who hasn't left yet. If this affects me, I will. I am absolutely fed up with RIAA/MPAA lobbyists and their effect on the entire ecosystem. I'm pretty sure that if large services like Netflix allow themselves to get locked down by these types, people will start migrating. Bottom line, my money should be good wherever I am, and I am not your digital property. This policy offends me.

    • You are offended for the wrong reasons.

      "Geoblocking," exists to confine your purchases to your area, in support of your area. Your area has its own content for sale.

      That's precisely what's going on in Australia. The Aussie content providers are pissed that Aussies want American stuff instead of Aussie stuff. Think of the children.

      • You are offended for the wrong reasons.

        "Geoblocking," exists to confine your purchases to your area, in support of your area. Your area has its own content for sale.

        That's precisely what's going on in Australia. The Aussie content providers are pissed that Aussies want American stuff instead of Aussie stuff. Think of the children.

        A whole bunch of Canadian made content is not available on Canadian Netflix but is available on US Netflix.

  • I use VPN on my home firewall in San Francisco to a gateway in Silicon Valley because I don't want my ISP spying on my web traffic. Netflix blocked my ability to stream as well, so I canceled my Netflix service. It's annoying when the privacy conscious get conflated with the pirates.
  • ... someone I know configured their computer to get US netflix up here by apparently simply changing the IP addresses it used for DNS from dynamically received from the uplink DHCP server to certain static IP's. I'm pretty sure that's not using VPN.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by PRMan ( 959735 )
      Adfreetime automated this and they have confirmed that they are no longer going to attempt to route around Netflix.

  • Geolocking shakedown (Score:4, Interesting)

    by geekpowa ( 916089 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @05:36PM (#51943233)

    Step 1: try to acquire content via one of my PAYG preferred streaming services legally
    Step 2 : torrent (or wait for physical distribution and borrow the discs off someone else)

    I don't mind paying for content and 90% of content I do consume is paid for. I don't even mind too much if rights holders try and charge me significantly more than what they charge other regions as long as it is accessible and the price points are reasonable. What fkn shits me is having to deal with and enrich elusive rights digital arbitragers although they provide little value add in the supply chain. Also tracking down an old film that is 20+ years old, finding it is digitally accessible elsewhere but not where I live. I feel no ethical qualms about opening torrent under those circumstances.

    Music is rarely geolocked. Why is film/TV treated differently?

    • I enjoy a lot of Japanese music, and the vast majority of it is geoblocked. I haven't really found any alternatives aside from going to Japan and buying a bunch of CDs.

      Makes me sad...

      • That sucks. I try to get to Fuji Rock every couple of years. Generally I've had no trouble tracking down and streaming the local acts on the lineup via google play.

      • Have you tried using a VPN? Netflix is big enough that the MAFIAA bullied them into blocking VPN traffic, but would various Japanese sellers even bother?

  • Australia (Score:3)

    by labnet ( 457441 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @07:18PM (#51943887)

    Yes, Netflix stopped blocking US content from Australia via DNS spoofers; but the DNS services have already worked around the blockades.

    Netflix gets to save face saying we implemented blocking plans (which they did).
    Users still get to access other regions because of technical workarounds.

  • happy (Score:3)

    by Smiddi ( 1241326 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @08:16PM (#51944171)
    Its nothing more than Netflix keeping Hollywood happy - "yes we have done something to stop these pesky VPN'ers, our media overlords"

  • Hardship of innocents (Score:4, Informative)

    by qe2e! ( 1141401 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @08:27PM (#51944231)
    I've worked in their customer care (recently quit). There is such a thing as false positives, little old ladies who don't know the difference between a proxy and a flux capacitor. And the company line for someone calling about a VPN error? Do **not** help or advise them in anyway except telling them to undo what they've done whatever that was, and call the ISP to help find what default settings should be. Next thing you know, you've got a rep from the ISP calling in because an entire IP block is getting flagged, and nobody can actually cite any particular instruction, marker, or standard for why it's getting flagged and what needs to be done about it. I can tell you this, the corporation looks to weigh the undue hardship of innocents in dollars, and that ought to be incompatible with some ethical systems.

  • He's lying (Score:5, Interesting)

    by jnork ( 1307843 ) on Tuesday April 19, 2016 @08:40PM (#51944313)

    They're not blocking people who use VPN to bypass geo-blockades. They're blocking VPN users, full stop. Without regard to why they're using VPN.

    I was rather irritated to find that I could no longer use my VPN to access US content from the US using a US VPN IP address. Guys, I'm right here in Sacramento, and dammit, I'm using VPN for security, not to bypass your pathetic little attempts to screw your customers.

    As a result I ended up finding other ways to bypass their restrictions. Which is something I would never have done if they hadn't blocked me in the first place! Morons.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by nnull ( 1148259 )
      I'm using a VPN to access Netflix, I'm already annoyed by the blockade and I barely find any content worth watching on Netflix anyways.

  • The sooner they realize that it's not a good idea to segregate people on a geographical basis in a global market the better.
    I'm not jumping ship, I never even got on, and I won't until all the content will be available globally. But I did cancel my spotify subscription when it refused to play the music I wanted.

    They put all kinds of restrictions on subscribers, and they wonder why piracy is still a thing.

    • Yeah, but how do we make the MPAA (or RIAA in your other example) die? It isn't Netflix causing this, and letting them die won't fix the problem.

  • "Netflix doesn't hurt us" -My former cable provider

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